"I wanted the class to be a mode of liberation": An interview with professor & filmmaker PJ Raval

This past Friday, May 2nd, Hyperreal Film Club was host to professor and filmmaker PJ Raval’s University of Texas, Austin Queer Media Production student film showcase. 18 short films created by the students were screened, rooted in the class’ values of community care, creative resourcefulness, meaningful risk-taking, and liberatory world-making. Ahead of the event, I sat down with Raval to discuss his experience with the course and the value of queer filmmaking–especially in our current political climate. 

PJ Raval and his Queer Media Production class at Hyperreal Film Club. Image courtesy of PJ Raval.

I was hoping we could start by talking about your Queer Media Production course. What inspired it, and what were your goals?

 So my husband also teaches at UT [The University of Texas] Austin, Dr. Curran Nault, and for many years he created and taught a queer Media Studies class. And I've seen him teach that class and other classes like transgender television or queer art and activism, and I was always a little bit jealous that these studies folks and scholars get to really dive into some of these things that I think as filmmakers and creators and artists, we think about also, just maybe in different ways, and maybe not even knowing the exact terms of certain histories.

There was a quote from this queercore filmmaker, GB Jones, who said something to the extent of, queer theory, oh, we lived it, you know? Maybe just think about that, how come as a filmmaker I'm not able to access this kind of way of thinking and way of speaking and a framework for a class in the way that a studies scholar can. And I understand there's different reasons for different types of classes, but I've always also wanted to challenge the way that we think about teaching film in the first place, and I think a lot of that has to do with me having an art background. The program that I went to, and the way that we learned things, was from a very conceptual standpoint. It has more to do with the thought and how you express it. And then how do you use the medium to best enhance that idea.

I started putting all these things together, and also feeling like there's a disconnect sometimes between students studying theory and then getting into these production classes. And production right now tends to be so heavy in focusing on industry. How do we make a film, and how does that enter Hollywood, and how do we connect to the industry? And I personally don't always make films with an industry in mind. I make films because I want to screen for a bunch of queer people, I make films sometimes because I want to have a good time with friends who are queer performers. So I thought maybe this could be an opportunity to make a little bit of a bridge. I actually made the suggested prerequisites for my class Dr. Nault's studies courses. I also opened the class to non-filmmakers who study in the department of Women, Gender and Sexuality studies [WGSS], or LGBTQ studies. And I thought a lot about how I had been making films as a queer individual and as a queer artist.

I know you are, like you just said, a queer filmmaker, and I know you're also a community organizer, and you're putting these pieces together. So how do you see this course in conversation with your filmmaking work and your community work?

I really thought about, for me, what I consider queer identity, and what is queerness to begin with. And I think from the initial perspective, sure, like the idea of queerness being thought provoking and challenging, these almost undefinable intersections between gender and sexuality, and maybe even concepts of the future or individuality, all of these things. But I also think queerness is so rooted in history and community organizing and space building and rejection of political systems and oppression, all of the things that we experience as queer individuals. So I started thinking about, well, if we're talking about queer filmmaking, we're talking about the subject and the content of it. But we're also talking about the way it's being made, the resourcefulness, the understanding of the reception of it, and maybe even a little bit of joy knowing that it's going to open some people's minds and maybe even poke a little bit at some spots that make people a little uncomfortable. I think that's all of the queer experience, right? Like we walk home, we have to be in front of a school board, or be in a classroom, or be in line to get a driver's license, like people dealing with gender markers, all of these things that just happen in everyday life that informs the kind of stories we tell, the work that we make, and how we make it. I wanted it to be this really holistic view of what it means to be a queer filmmaker or a queer media maker.

How did your students respond to that?

I was optimistic, because I do think, having taught at UT for many years now, the students really are so inspiring to me because they are excited, they're optimistic, they're finding their voices and their identities, and all we can do is encourage that. So I kind of thought this is going to be my offering to you all, and let's see what you do with it. And they responded in the most amazing way. I couldn't have asked for a better response. A lot of the things I did I know were slightly unconventional and asking them to think a little bit differently from some other classes, and they were up for it, and they really brought it.

Did anything they do surprise you?

Yeah, actually, I also have shown a lot of queer films, so part of what I did is root it in certain pillars. Like community care, meaningful risk taking, liberatory futures, certain ways of thinking and making, and they embraced every one of them. They took every assignment very seriously, and they opened up very personally. There are people in the class who have performed in drag for the very first time, because they wanted to explore that in in some of the filmmaking, there are people who have never made films who are suddenly behind or in front of the camera. They surprised me with how willing they were to put themselves out there.

I want to drill down a little bit more on one of your class pillars being community, and the importance of community as a practice of queer art making. Why did you choose to center community in that way?

If we think about it, the film industry is probably one of the biggest offenders when it comes to ethics and culture, right? Like maybe it's not a surprise that Harvey Weinstein is a film producer and was a big igniter of the #MeToo movement. You know, offensive representations or lack of representations on screen. What’s interesting to me about filmmaking is it's so present in everyone's lives, and it really encapsulates a lot of our cultural wins and also our cultural gems, but also our cultural failures. And I think so much of it changes according to who's making it, why they're making it, and the support they have to make it.

And just like when we think of these really large topics like justice, what are barriers to justice, right? It could be poverty, it could be class, it could be identity, it could be location. I feel like access to filmmaking and the impact of filmmaking is also there's barriers to it. And I think the ways to overcome some of these barriers, and they've always been, from what I've learned in terms of organizing and just paying attention to social justice movements, so much of it is centering that idea of community, like, how are you making this? Who are you making it with? Who are you making it also for, and who is there to uplift you during this process?

The other thing that I really thought about, too, is why I like making films in the first place. And I really do like making films because it is a collaborative medium. It's very community driven. I like working with a lot of people. I like filming people. I like working alongside people. And I wanted to really emphasize that too with the students.

The other reason I centered community is because I think a lot of us, and I'm going to speak personally now, discover our queerness through community. Whether that be standing in a space and just looking around you, whether that be attending a pride celebration or an alternative pride celebration, or, you know, when you're around others that you feel you connect with, and you can't even describe what that connection is. I feel like that's a really powerful thing. So me putting that into the classroom is also really powerful. And I think we have been encouraged to do that thinking about, okay, we're all connecting as filmmakers, but are we connecting beyond that? For me, this class was an opportunity to do that.

Continuing that thread of thinking about bridging queer theory and queer practice, in your class materials you talk about queerness as this artistic sensibility, not just an identity, but a mode to exist in and make art in. To you, what does that look like in the context of filmmaking?

I think in the context of filmmaking, it's resourcefulness, because as we know a lot of queer individuals don't get all the resources that they need to make work. I think it's survival, because it's also ultimately a mode of expression. All the feelings you have, all the stress and tension you feel in your life, the state of the world, the state of the Texas legislature, the state of the Federal administration, all of these things, you can put into a film and express it. So I think it's a mode of survival. It's a mode of expression. And for me, one of the things that I wanted the class to be also, is, for lack of a better word, a mode of liberation. You know, you can create a world in your films, and that's the world you want to live in, or that's the world that you see, that you want everyone to understand, or that's the system of artmaking with whoever you want to be in that room with you. And there's something kind of liberating, knowing that you and your community can do it.

How did it feel going through this course, in the current moment that we're in, politically?

 I mean, it feels great. The way that I feel about it is there are certain laws in place, and there are certain lawmakers, and they are actively trying to remove rights, silence, disempower. And what I've always known, and this class has just really helped me confirm, is that the students and the world is progressing in one direction, and nobody wants to go back, and it makes things much, much more difficult for us. It makes it makes things really heartbreaking. But I think at the core, the students know what their values are, and they're not afraid to put that into their filmmaking. And that has given me so much hope and optimism that, I mean, it's something that's helped me, you know? So in that sense, I think for me, that's what it means at this moment, is political systems and institutions might be challenged and might be failing, but the people are not, my community is not. My community is surviving, and if anything, they're thriving.

Absolutely, yeah. I'm curious, I feel like this is kind of a corny question, but I do mean it seriously. What do you feel like you learned or gained from your students going through this class?

I think what I've learned from my students is to be open to new experiences, to be receptive to others, to learn how to navigate community, and a willingness to put oneself out there. One of the pillars of the class, and even one of the assignments was about this idea of meaningful risk taking, right? And my concept was, you know, there's always a vulnerability and a sense of uneasiness for queer individuals, because there's always this potential for backlash. We understand we're entering things that we might not even understand ourselves, navigating all of that, so us figuring out how to maneuver that and try to gain some kind of self-empowerment from that kind of position.

And the students did, I mean, they really pushed themselves in terms of putting themselves in films, making films that they haven't made before. And as someone as myself, who, compared to them, could be considered a more seasoned veteran filmmaker, it was a reminder to me, like, oh yeah, where are my comfort zones? Have I just started kind of resting in my comfortable spots of filmmaking, like how am I continuing to challenge myself and push myself? And ultimately, that's how we grow as people and as artists. So I think for me, what has been amazing is I've seen the growth firsthand in this class. I have seen students grow as filmmakers, as people, as queer individuals, and if anything, what I've taken from that is I should be also thinking about my own growth. We're constantly growing as people and as artists.

Thinking more broadly, what to you is the importance of queer filmmaking?

I think there's a huge importance for this class. Because I think one of the things I really love about filmmaking is how accessible it is to everyone. It's a popular art form, but it's also a mode of communication and storytelling. It allows for collective experiences. People watch the same thing and have conversations about it and have different opinions. People can be in a movie theater together and experience something simultaneously. It's really powerful in a lot of those ways.

And I think queerness, and especially the LGBTQ+ community, has gained more visibility, but we have to recognize some of that visibility and access has been limited and has been made available to certain people with certain privileges. And it's important for us to always be thinking about who else is not being included and who else doesn't have that support. So for me, thinking about this class is thinking about that and empowering the students to know that they can make work however, whenever.

For someone who couldn't take your class, what would you tell them to do if they were similarly interested in this practice of filmmaking?

I would say adopt a punk ethos and figure out how to borrow some equipment. It doesn't have to be fancy. It literally can be a phone or an old camera, and just start making, and I think experience is how you learn, and whether that be in a classroom or just out in life. I think that's also the queer experience. At least when I was growing up, there wasn't a class that I took, or there wasn't a particular mentor I had, I just kind of had to stumble through it and live it. So I place a lot of emphasis on lived experience. Lived experience can be figuring out how to be an artist also and a filmmaker.

Yeah, that's great. I think this is such a cool class. Is there anything else that you want to say in regards to your class or the students?

Some students have expressed to me that they had always felt like they were a little bit of an outsider, or couldn't quite find their footing in some of the other film classes, and now they feel like they have found it or found a way, and that's been really important to me. And I also want to mention I don't think I'm fully alone in thinking of these ways, like one of my colleagues, Iliana Sosa, has started a Latinx filmmaking class, and that's really exciting. Miguel Alvarez has been teaching a class called East Austin Stories, which is a documentary class looking at stories from East Austin and that, you know, that typically has been looking at communities that are marginalized, you know, in Austin are constantly being displaced. I think Ya'Ke Smith, one of my colleagues, is also teaching a class on social justice filmmaking.

So I think many of us are thinking outside of these usual kind of film school boxes, but one of the things I do want to say that I'm very proud of is when I first suggested this class, there was excitement and intrigue, but there was also a lot of doubt, thinking that there wouldn't be a lot of students taking it. And I'm really proud that the class was full. It was a popular course. The students were engaged. They really liked it. So it just shows that the students are ready for this, and if anything, maybe we as instructors are just kind of catching up to it.

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