Getting Hyperreal With... Erica Nix and This Is Not A Cult

On the heels of Hyperreal Film Club’s initial January 9th screening and ahead of the February 13th encore, Hyperreal interviewer extraordinaire Justin Norris sat down with Erica’s First Holy Shit star Erica Nix and co-directors Sawyer Stoltz, Jeremy Von Stilb, and Jessica Gardner, to discuss Zoom orgies, Austin’s changing art scene, Gwyneth Paltrow, and the challenges of creating a film during the COVID-19 pandemic.

Editor’s Note: This interview has been lightly condensed and edited for clarity.

Hyperreal Film Club: So to dive right into it, I got the chance to watch Erica’s First Holy Shit, which - I love the title. I feel like it's one of those titles that you could just say casually in life. But after watching it, one of the first questions that comes to my mind, for each of you, was what was the most challenging aspects when making this film?

Sawyer Stoltz (Co-director, Co-writer, Producer): I'll just jump in and say that I think the biggest challenge was the lack of resources, you know, and we really relied heavily on the Austin community of performers to like, kind of load us by and, you know, really achieve an incredible feat with minimum budget behind it. I don't know if anyone else wants to say something but that to me was the biggest challenge aside from like, trying to do it during the pandemic.

Jeremy Von Stilb (Co-director, Co-writer, Producer): Yeah, the pandemic really shaped the project. We originally started out thinking [Erica’s First Holy Shit] was going to be a live show. And we thought we were going to be just filming some segments to break up some of the live performances, and then we just were stuck in our houses more and more and more, and then at some point it was like, “Oh, I think this is going to be a movie actually.” And so it was just really hard navigating how to complete this project when we really could not be in the same place very often. And it was a lot of, you know, back bends and flips through hoops to sort it out. And we were constantly revising as we went along.

SS: I will say that one thing that came along with a pandemic, it was kind of like a restriction of parameters that provided kind of a creative launching pad to think of unique ways to achieve a greater story. You know, we had to deal a lot with scenes that focused on two people that may or may not be able to film together in one scene. And I just think that being first time filmmakers, we also kind of thought beyond maybe what financial constraints would normally dissuade people from making smaller choices. But by default, we ended up kind of achieving something grandiose and beyond what the page presented.

Jessica Gardner (Co-director, Lead DP, Producer): I wouldn't call myself a first-time filmmaker! I just wanted throw that out! [Laughs]

SS: Well, sure!

HFC: Well, to the credit of each of you, it didn't seem like a first-time film when I saw that in the notes. I was like, “Oh, okay!” But I guess it's kind of the benefit that comes when you have a nice little quadruple thing going on here. You know, if one person falls, you get three other people that hold you up! So, I think you all have a good thing going!

JVS: Thank you!

HFC: I was reading some of the background notes on the film and you mentioned that you all filmed this during the pandemic. Obviously, COVID-19 had an impact on just how things were shot, when they were shot…How long did it take to, from conception to completion, complete this film?

Erica Nix (Actress, Star): It was about three years?

JG: Two is what I said…

EN: Okay, yeah. I was surprised when I was looking, trying to do that stupid like, Instagram new year thing. I was looking back, and we were still finishing the film this year. For some reason, it just feels like it was at least a year ago, but we were still doing, like, Pink Star was still doing voiceover then. Yeah, I guess it was two years with the pandemic…

SS: We really started weekly Zoom meetings as a practice in March of 2020 leading up to, you know, the premiere in April of 2022. Does that sound right? Or was it June?

JG: When we started meeting or when we screened?

SS: No, first meeting of March 2022. We had a fundraising event for post-production and then premiered at A-glyph.

JG: Right. So, we had a rough cut by March of 2022. And then did another round of sound design, we got color grading from Stuck On On production studio in town and did some more stuff.

EN: We got started, I mean, in September when we stayed at Molly's place when I just got Mike. That's when we started our first filming in September of 2021. And [it was] the most difficult shoot ever.

JVS: That was the Gwyneth Paltrow scene, which was the first scene that actually got written before we were thinking, “Oh, let's make a movie!” Because we had originally done a live show at the Austin Motel Pool and it was very like, about wellness culture. And, you know, we had some, I think unfinished business with the first live show so that was the original thought, like, “Okay, do a follow up and delve even deeper but let's maybe have like more of a narrative because the other one was like a variety show.” And so, Gwyneth obviously just felt like the best person to start satirizing. And, you know, Gwyneth’s character tells Erica to dig within and find her path and I think that actually planted the seed for the film as well. So, she's been with us since the start. So, thank you, Gwyneth!

HFC: Would you say this film would have even existed, if it wasn't for COVID-19 and just being locked up in a house. Would you say this film would have come about?

EN: It would have been a multimedia show, and we would have had a grant pay for it! [Laughs] So, it would’ve been something different, but it would have been free! [Laughs]

JG: Sounds great! [Laughs]

SS: I also don't think like any of us would have had the bandwidth or time to put the effort into this with our day-to-day work that we do. If it weren't for the pandemic, putting a pause on group gatherings, live performances, whatever it may be, you know, it affected us each kind of very specifically, but in a way that also opened opportunities that wouldn't have been available otherwise, the biggest resource being time.

JVS: And we certainly wouldn't have opened the film with a Zoom orgy.

SS: Very true.

JVS: Erica was casually telling us about her weekly Zoom orgies, and I was like, my mind was totally bent in half by that, and she described them and I was like, “Okay, can you ask everyone's permission if we can turn that into part of the project?” And thankfully, they jumped on and that was such a bizarre shoot because it really was shot on Zoom.

EN: It was the first weekend too, the same as the Gwyneth [scene]. That's why it was the worst weekend ever! After, we were so exhausted we were like, “And then let's do this on Zoom.” And I don't know how Jessica made it look good because it was pretty much a pile. No one like, recorded it correctly, because you have to record it on the cloud I guess, to have different like - Sawyer and Jeremy were like pinning squares and it wasn't recording it at all that way. They were just like pinning it for their own view apparently, which we thought they were capturing larger screens and we were so mad at each other. [Laughs]

SS: I will say that the opening sequence is a testament to Jess’s editing skills because after the Zoom capture I said there's no way in hell we're going to be able to use this and really, it's - It's impressive! [Laughs]

HFC: I would say it turned out great from my perspective! You know, I did not get any vibe of y'all are mad at each other the day of filming.

EN: No, we weren’t mad at them! We were mad that we thought we didn’t have like, high-res footage! [Laughs]

SS: Yeah, it's kind of chaos to instruct people remotely. 12 individuals - nine, whatever it would have been, remotely what to do in real time in synchronicity, because, inevitably, you know, with lag and whatnot, nothing's ever going to line up exactly. And it just presented a lot of challenges. [Laughs]

JVS: Next time we have the Zoom orgy, we need an intimacy coach, and I’ll personally see to that. [Chuckles] But everyone pulled it off. I mean, it seemed challenging enough to get to people naked in front of a camera and nine beautiful people pulled it off, so I'm grateful for that!

HFC: Yeah, that might be a record! Not to mention simultaneous orgasms caught on camera. Potentially…maybe…I don’t know! [Laughs]

SS: Not to mention the career deficit of a digital intimacy coach. So, you know if you're looking for opportunities, I think there's a field!

HFC: Kind of talking about that scene. One of the first things I had an appreciation for was lining up everyone handing stuff to each other. You know, everyone was handing the Hitachi off. How long did that take? Was that a complex process? Or did that come about pretty easy?

JG: I mean, really, I wouldn’t say that was that hard. Alright, like I had to take the grid and cut the people apart and shift the timing around so that it looked right. It was one of the last things that I really edited because I just kept putting it off because it was such a…a headache! [Laughs].

SS: But y'all did have…there was a lot of discussion prior to you know, the attempt, wasn’t there?

EN: We showed up and it was like, “Now you! Now you!” I mean it was like-

SS: It was chaos.

EN: It was chaos.

JG: They did have to know to have those vibrators that all matched. You know, that was pre-planned!

SS: Yeah, and it did involve doing some personal Hitachi wand drop offs to specific individuals houses during the pandemic, so it was like you know - it was like a plastic bag, Hitachi wand sticking out top. [Laughs]

EN: Sometimes I feel embarrassed about it, but I also did just get diagnosed with MS, so at that Gwyneth scene, I was still like tripping over my feet. I had pretty bad brain fog. I'm not good at memorizing lines anyway but everyone here was super patient. I had a lot of like, not being able to say a sentence that someone just told me that was like five words long. Like my health was really - I didn't know how much of it was temporary or how much I was just gonna forever never remember anything. So, a lot of stuff was going on in that moment for sure, for me. That might have been the hardest challenge for me personally.

JG: Well, like in the bathtub scene too…like, there’s a line where she's like, “I can't feel my legs right now,” and that was based on like, the real life experience of the MS symptoms that she was having, like before she knew what it was. So, she's been through that whole experience while we were working on the film. And so, it's really strange, like the little pieces of that experience that are in the script aren't necessarily from the viewpoint of knowing, you know, like, it's so weird, like that line! I don’t know! [Laughs]

JVS: After that first screening, someone walked up to me and they're like, “I truly believe you captured Erica’s autobiography.”

HFC: That was actually one of my other questions. It almost blew my mind because credit wise, Jeremy and Sawyer, you both are the credited writers. But it seems like this is a very Erica Nix story. It seems real! And you know, Erica even just mentioned the specific instance of real-life kind of bleeding into certain forms in a certain scene. How was that writing process? Erica, I didn't see you credited but I'm assuming you were working with Jeremy and Sawyer - and Jessica, you may have been in the writers’ room too and I know y'all are a collective, This Is Not A Cult, so what did that writing process look like?

SS: I will say that as a group we're basically all in the room every second of the entire duration of the creation process. But a lot of the content is us just listening to Erica and bouncing ideas off each other. And a lot of the script is taking what Erica has verbatim said and kind of like, just reshaping them and kind of identifying what serves the greater narrative. But a lot of the comedy and joy and you know, emotion that you experienced within the context of what's being said is truly Erica. It is genuinely Erica. It's 100% Erica, so like, Jeremy and I are kind of just sounding boards and really just more giving shape and structure to what is being said.

EN: I mean, y’all are adding jokes! I don't know if you've ever been to like brunch with a bunch of gay men but it's like this cool story, and they're like “And then!” and like, the story gets bigger and bigger and more amazing and hilarious. That is what it is just like.

SS: Sure. You know, we take everything, we scrutinize it sentence by sentence, we add jokes, we punctuate it, we try to elevate it, we try to make it more funny, but really, at the end of the day, there's just such a grand opportunity to mine Erica's life, you know, in a non-exploitive way. It's really joyous. It's collaborative. It's fun, like we're all having the best time.

JVS: That’s what's impressive about Erica is how unguarded she is and how generous she is with her life stories and the things that have embarrassed her, her challenges or her obstacles, because they're things we all go through and I think that's why people are really drawn to her because she's just saying, “Oh, my God, I had the worst thing happen to me, and I'm gonna tell you in great detail!” and everyone is like, “Yeah, I've been there, but I'm not gonna like do it in front of a microphone!” [Laughs] So, I'm just very appreciative that she allowed us to do a deep psychological mining of her life. But really, all of us, all of our stories, you know, I was able to put my point of view through like, one of those scenes was where I was working out a lot of the frustrations I was dealing with, like, watching like Black Lives Matters and all these protests while we're stuck in our houses. And, you know, that's one of those examples where I have immense gratitude that Erica would kind of lend her platform for us to also explore ourselves because I think a lot of people do relate to what Erica is going through in this story.

HFC: Yeah, it really did feel like a collective group effort. And even outside of y'all - just with everyone y'all brought in, it felt in a way like a family movie. There's that air of comfort everyone has with each other. Even as we see all this ridiculous stuff, even as Erica is in Mother Nature's asshole, you know, there's still a warmth there that's hard to pull off. So, props to you all on that! But yeah, this one might be geared a little bit more towards you, Erica, but obviously Jeremy, Sawyer, and Jessica, as y'all were helping write this as well, y'all can answer too. But touching on the kind of sort of autobiographical topics in the script and then the story for this movie, why do you think you kind of viewed it through an absurdist lens rather than making this in a straight face or, you know, a slightly more serious manner? What kind of gravitates y'all towards that comedic, absurdist angle when talking about real stuff that isn't always quite funny necessarily when you talk about it on its own.

EN: Well, I don't feel comfortable being serious about anything like that, you know? Like, that's way more vulnerable than using comedy around it. And also, I think that we needed like, I mean - I feel like that's what I needed was to laugh about that stuff with other people, you know?

JG: I think there's a dynamic in this group where, you know, and all of us do all of the things, but it's like, Erica is this larger-than-life personality with these great stories, with this perspective, with this je nais se quois. Then Jeremy has these kinds of outlandish ideas and imagination, this kind of overarching big picture, like, “And then we're in Satan's room!” and, you know, he will kind of present you with these crazy scenarios. And then Sawyer has this really amazing way with words where he can kind of take the things and shape them and he - I love the lyricism of the way that he writes like, it’s like all of these elements coming together are the things that sort of formed the script. And then I’m more in the visual storytelling area, you know. Like how, “Okay, we're gonna be, you know, Paul's going to become a giant, and then she's going to get in his butt, like, how are we going to do that?” So that's kind of the general flow of how we gather.

SS: But the short of it is that we're all avoidant attachment style. [Laughs] I mean, this is like a form of escapism for us. The last two and a half years gave us so much to deal with that I don't think there was a way to process it other than, like, move through it with humor, and kind of like, deal with it in the most absurd ways.

JVS: All of 2020, I think, every conversation for months was like “I can't believe this is real!”

SS: Yeah! [Chuckles]

JVS: I mean, that's where Absurdism in art came from! It’s people feeling like, what we perceive as reality is actually really disgusting and life shouldn't be that way and so you make art that's like, feels really gonzo, and you exaggerate every single element because internally, that's how you're perceiving.

SS: Because, yeah, we were living in unreality.

EN: Yeah, but I think we all like to - we all just love humor… right? I am depressed on my own but when I'm with my friends I like, do not want to be depressed! If I'm gonna be sad I just want to be alone. [Laughs]

SS: Yeah, you might as well be making a joke about it! [Laughs]

JG: I don't even know what the story would even be if you tried to make it a straight faced something, you know?

HFC: It was a layered kind of watch. There’s that immediate comedic, crazy aspect that you're hit with and then you sit with it, whether after the movie or while it goes to the next scene like “Wait, they were actually talking about this or this, which is a serious topic.” So, it works in that way to keep your interest and just keep you more engaged. And using absurdity to do that is no easy feat, I would also say. Going off that gonzo, kind of exaggerated, absurd approach, when y'all were crafting these sequences was there ever a moment where y'all would say to yourselves, maybe step back and be like, “This is a little too much.” Or would y'all just have this gung-ho mindset like “This is an idea. We're gonna throw it out and whatever sticks, sticks! Whatever doesn’t, who cares!”

EN: Yeah, I tried to get Jeremy not to do so many things, but he loves the big thing. So, it was like, we all would have things we'd stick our flags in the ground and be like, “This is happening! This is mine!” and we'd have to just be like, “Alright,” you know?

JVS: The only thing I said no to was a poop joke. But I was totally fine with all period blood jokes. [Laughs]

HFC: I'm not going to lie, I honestly thought based off this movie's title, because I read nothing about it, I thought this movie was going to have a lot of fecal related jokes and/or matter. And I'm not saying I'm disappointed that there wasn't a lot, or none of that. But you know, that was one of the surprises for me! [Laughs]

EN: Well, I was just thinking about how the big game show was like a huge endeavor. And how Jeremy's been wanting to do that in a live form or something for a long time. It was obviously the most expensive part of the whole movie. And so I was like, “Why?!” but then on the - yeah, the poop one and Satan's thing we were trying to figure out if I should get like, poop in my hair. You know, like, put maple syrup on me. And Jeremy was grossed out like – [Laughs] And we don't want, you know, we don't have the kind of days or times or costume changing to go back on it. So, it's just like we just have to choose with or without maple syrup. [Laughs] I didn't know his tummy was so sensitive!

JVS: Yeah, it was funny to me that I was just like, “I don't know…” and you're like, “But you like that period blood joke!” and I'm like, “Yeah, that's fine. That's cool!” [Laughs] I’m trying to think if we ever tried scaling anything back. I mean, it was always like can we actually do it? And I think Sawyer and I always wrote some wacky stuff, but then Jessica always would come at it with blocking everything totally differently than it was written which just made it like so much cooler and more dynamic. Because I think in my head, it was very 2D and, because I was just like, “Oh, it's gonna all be green screen and like, we have to shoot this to be safe in a certain way,” And then Jessica kind of like, you know, the Christine scene, she made all the ideas of Christine growing and all that stuff, who also was directed via Zoom in New York City! So, Paul was not even with us, so Jessica took really hilarious cellphone photos of her and photoshopped them together and it just exploded what was on the page and made it way more fun! And, you know, again, it was just like we're trying to work within our confines, but then still found ways to continually twist the challenge of making a movie while not being able to be on set together.

EN: Yeah, there's no way we could have done so many scenes without Jessica's know how.

HFC: It sounds like you guys took unintentionally the hardest road to make a movie. And it turned out great! I mean, you got actors who aren't even there in person, there’s a pandemic going on, all that stuff, and you all still get this out there. That's no small feat!

JVS: One would have thought making a feature length film during the pandemic would have been a really great distraction, but it just made everything so much harder. [Laughs]

EN: What, the film made life harder?

JVS: It made our lives harder! [Laughs]. Everyone else was doing puzzles and knitting.

HFC: But not everybody could say they filmed and performed in Mother Nature's asshole. So, you know, people may be making bread or making poems, but they can't say they did that!

SS: That’s true. [Laughs]

HFC: Going back to the script and kind of touching on the topic of all these local creatives and local Austin legends that you all have the opportunity to work with and bring in…From a writing perspective, did y'all have these specific people in mind when writing the script or did that just come along naturally? And two, what was it like to work with all these different creatives? Like, did the collaboration process for each performer change?

EN: Yeah, when you work with everyone you work with what their strengths are and how they like, right? Because we're not really paying them very much so it's very collaborative, and what is easier for them. So, someone like Nikki is going to prefer us to tell her what to do, she doesn't want to have to think about it. She has this much time, and we're in there, and she does it in like one or two takes and someone like Paul Christine, [they] were just going to, like, want to make up almost everything they say. Would you say that?

SS: Yeah, I will say the characters kind of came first. Like we concepted the plot, but then we obviously wanted to work with as many local artists as we could. But there was kind of a logical fit for each person but then, when we approached each scene, as Erica mentioned, like, we kind of allowed for a lot of individual collaboration fit for each person. And that was kind of the fun part of it, to present them with material and then allowing them to manipulate it and kind of adjusting how it panned out.

JG: Yeah, you did trade emails with Nikki about what her script would be like, didn't you Erica? I thought I remembered that.

EN: I think Jeremy and Sawyer…

SS: I mean, there was a lot of back and forth, especially with Nikki. A lot of that segment had to do with the Black Lives Matter movement and kind of what was going on in the world at that moment. We didn't necessarily want to  dictate what it was she was saying to Erica, so we kind of did sit with her and say, like, “What are your gripes?” like, “What do you want to address?” like, “What is it that you want to say and communicate in this moment?” and kind of took it from there, gave it some structure, and then allowed her to play with the language itself so it did sound authentic and like it was her.

JVS: And Andie Flores. Like, I kind of pitched her the same scene and then she's like, “Oh, Satan should like, have RuPaul as a client,” [Chuckles] So, we took her nugget of an idea. I mean, I'd like to just say the script was - it wasn't just the two of us sitting in a room. I mean, it was really like all of us working together as a quad and then also incorporating the actors, you know, it was very collaborative. And again, it was like you said, like a family affair, and these are people that we've all known for years. From working together and nightlife and, you know, we've all done like, comedy shows together or have done other things or done parties together, so these are people we all are already grooving with. So it all kind of came together organically with people who we just love as people and as creative professionals.

EN: Pink Star when she came back for her voiceover, she was like, “I could do so much better now.” [Laughs]

HFC: It was mentioned that Waking Life and The Holy Mountain were inspirations a bit for this film. Outside of those two, was there any other pieces of art that y’all found yourselves gravitating towards while making this?

JG: I mean, I'm happy how many articles have brought up John Waters because, you know, that's kind of the ultimate goal is to make John Waters movies in my mind! [Laughs]

SS: I endorse that full heartedly.

HFC: I think he'd be proud of this. I think he would. He might want more poop!

EN: Yeah!

JVS: And I think like, halfway through, because a lot of stuff was filmed on green screen and what came after was, you know, we played around. Again, I think we were just thinking we're going to use stock photography because we didn't quite have the ambitions yet because it was just like, “Okay, this is going to be a multimedia show,” and we sat on a lot of scenes for a long time. And I think we all kind of expressed a love for Pee Wee's Playhouse. I think that kind of stuck in our heads of like, how to do the background and bring in the miniature sets and the really low-fi claymation and stuff.

SS: Yeah, I would say there was kind of like a Michel Gondry-like use of practical things. A lot due to, you know, budget constraints, but also due to the kind of whimsical effect that it has on viewers.

EN: Yeah, but I don't know, I feel like with the water in the bathtub moving and it was like, it almost feels like - I remember Jeremy, I think, came up with that idea. But when we were doing it, we were – no? It was Sawyer?

SS: Yeah, not that it matters but please put that as my idea! [Laughs]

EN: Sorry! When we were doing it, I was like, “There's no way this is working,” you know what I mean? It was like, “Don't you have a mannequin?”. To me, it felt like, “This is really working?”.

JG: I was really doubtful about the paper in the bathtub.

EN: You were?

JG: Yeah.

EN: Probably why I was doubtful. You were probably influencing me. [Laughs]

HFC: I liked it! I even liked the little Kevin doodle on the Lush products. Shoutout to whoever animated that. There's just so many different visual styles going on and I think that's easy to get lost in but I think it works perfectly for this film.

JG: I love it now!

EN: Yeah! It was like, every step of the way, like “Oh, grab that mannequin hand! Grab that! Whatever we have to do!”.

SS: Well, I think we committed to some, let's say inventive ideas, in the process. And then like in post, we're like, “Oh, fuck!” like, “I guess we have to make this work now.” [Laughs]. You know, sometimes it worked out and sometimes it was maybe a stretch, but at the end of the day it added to the whimsy of it all.

HFC: That leads me to another question of mine: Were there any scenes that y'all either had filmed or wanted to really film that wasn't able to make the final cut?

SS: Yeah, you know, we pre-planned so vigorously that I don't think there was anything that was completely dropped because we had a fully formed script within one to two months of starting it. I’m sure there are tons of ideas that didn't develop into scenes that made it into the script. Like a thousand! We have a lot of zany shit that's maybe saved for another time but I would say like, there are no major regrets or omissions in my opinion. Someone speak up if they feel otherwise…

JG: I mean, I always thought we would make some kind of fake commercial to go after the American Guiltiators scene, but I mean I don't find that to be like a really sad omission, like we didn’t actually have like a specific idea.

SS: Yeah, but you know that was pending on securing a sponsor which never came through! [Laughs] Which is maybe a sad story to tell like, we wanted to like, so badly give some like sponsored product placement and we couldn’t convince anyone to do it! [Laughs]

EN: Well, we could’ve given Double Scorpio double placement but they only paid for the inflatable costume.

SS: We did pitch a [redacted energy drink company] that ended up not biting. [Laughs]

EN: I still can't believe they didn’t go for it!

JG: I liked that energy drink…[Laughs]

So, this is a very fun film. I can only imagine you guys were having fun even though you mentioned there's a couple of, you know, frustrations that would pop up here and there. That being said, for each of you what was the most enjoyable sequence to film?

EN: [Laughs] There's a lot! Like having Jeremy hump me in that outfit [was] really fun! And it was like an easy day, you know, we were in a public park so people walked by, and we had to hide me and it was pretty bonkers, very fun.

JVS: I think for me, the American Guiltiators scene was the day I felt the most proud because I think it was just a testament to all of our abilities. It took a lot of planning, it took a lot of replanning. We had to reschedule it multiple times and just when the lighting started and all the actors were in costume, I mean, it was also one of the only things we shot as a group, like a proper set, because it was post vaccination.

SS: Yeah.

JVS: And it was so hard but God, I was just like, “Man, we're really doing this!” and we've stuck with this project for a year and a half and, yeah, there's probably some moments where we all felt tempted to throw in the towel because it was just like the pandemic never seemed like it was going to end and it's draining to go on as a human during that time, as well as to stay with this project. And that shoot kind of was a testament to our determination.

EN: We had fun most of the time, you know! We’re like a big family, and like, I like to complain about my partners more than talk well of them so I just talk about fighting as well. I think the house scene where I'm talking about the dildos, that one's really fun! I just love the way it's written and it's also, to me, the heart of what it's about, you know? And it also was kind of adapted from our show at Austin Motel before so I kind of already knew it and my friends Jesse and Len are both the Richard Simmons…I feel like that whole thing was like, just a beautiful day outside. It was good! I don't even know how many days it was. Probably like three days…[Chuckles]

JVS: Yeah, that was really fun!

SS: I just remember it'd feel like comfy, cozy, pleasant, halcyon days, like, “Aren't we cute?” [Laughs]

JG: Pink Star’s day was pretty, pretty sweet, too! I don’t know, it was a really cute location. Pink Star was so sweet! [Laughs]

SS: It's a tender scene! I feel like after the Zoom orgy, the opening monologue, and the Pink Star scene, like, they’re so sentimental. They genuinely like get me when I watch them. Like I might get choked up! [Chuckles]

HFC: Y'all mentioned the opening scene. I agree with that, hearing y'all talk about how it felt like it's a true doorway to the rest of the craziness that will come. And even then, the opening scene is a little off kilter. But full credit to Erica, it's a very welcoming scene. And, you know, I think it'll bring audiences in, and then you’re still not prepared for what follows!

JG: Yeah, one night Erica was really depressed or something and then she did this big brain dump and wrote all this stuff. And the whole Leslie connection, you know, with Leslie running for mayor in the past and her mom thinking she’s becoming that homeless person or whatever. A lot of that scene came from that brain dump. And it seemed kind of, I don't know - It was pretty moving to me reading it, because I didn't know all of that, you know?

HFC: No, I agree. You know, I'm not like a native to Austin so I was unaware of the legend of Leslie. So as a newcomer hearing that story, and then seeing it still play out a little as he pops up towards the end, I thought it was nice. Like we talked about this feels like a family film and while Leslie isn't with us anymore, it still feels like one of the OG’s is still around thanks to y'all by immortalizing them in the film.

SS: I mean, yeah, out of that process that Jess mentioned, it was kind of like an aha moment that Leslie as like a concept was the emotional throughline of the film. And kind of like everything was poised to lead to that momentous moment, like whether or not you're along for the ride or thinking she's out of her mind, you're feeding into the energy and excitement.

EN: Because we decided to write all of it and that September, like, outside when I was hot, sitting in kiddie pools of ice water, I was like, “And then!”  I feel like maybe we all said that but at some point, it was like, “And then I run for mayor!” and we were like, “Yeah! Ha-ha-ha!” and I'll really run like, “Yeah, hilarious!” and then when it happened, I was just like, “Oh. My. God! I'm gonna like-” I don't know, y'all saw me, I was so stressed! You know, I didn't know what kind of damage I was going to create! [Laughs] Oh, man, like the reality of it, it was a totally different [thing].

SS: I think we're always just kind of like waffling behind these manic spurts of activity and ideas versus pausing and questioning the insanity of what was actually coming from those ideas. Erica had mentioned you know, and I'm not sure how real this was outside of like your initial research with the film, but she like did in real life register and run for mayor, which also fed into additional creative projects. We kind of collaborated on some campaign videos for Celia Israel and whatnot, some exciting but like ridiculous smear campaigns against Kirk Watson. [Laughs]

HFC: If I was a rival politician, I would not want this group making mud raking videos about me as I'm sure they would be very good! [Laughs] But actually, I kind of wanted to ask Erica about that experience. Because this film, in another time, would be a pretty effective campaign movie ad! But how was it, running for office? Do you have any plans to run again, Erica? And what did you take away from that experience?

EN: Oh man, so much. I think I was surprised at how many people were like, even some of my political friends before Celia was announced, or before they knew about her, they're like, “Why not? Yeah, do it! We're behind you!” And so, at first, it was exciting! But yeah, I mean, politics is kind of, like…dirty. You know, it's just a lot of my friends that actually work in politics, it just seems like it's so hard to get anything done and so my heart was breaking all the time just trying to talk to people into voting, you know? So, I was a little shocked about that, especially like, I don't know, but Barton Springs, I just ran into so many people just like, who don't vote at all. They're like, “I'm not a political person.” So, I found it really disheartening. And it's a lot of work. I don't even know if I could physically do it, honestly. Like, Celia doing it to the amount of going out and talking to people constantly. I felt like I needed to know more things. I kind of understand it a little bit more now. You know, it was really fun being Celia’s cheerleader. I really feel if we had gotten her the position I would be on top of the world right now. But I mean, her campaign people and she have told us that it felt like we really made a difference and brought a lot more attention to her campaign so that feels really good.

HFC: Yeah, for the whole group here, it's kind of touched on in the film and obviously, it's just a prevalent thing here in our area. Two prong question: Where do you see the future of Austin as a city heading? And where do you kind of see the creative side of it heading? Like are the creative aspects, in a good spot? Are there places, things, you could see improving? As people who interact with a bunch of people make things and stuff, what’s the temperature gauge from you on how you all see the creative side of Austin heading?

SS: I think it's kind of unrealistic to think that any city you live in isn't going to go through growth pains, but I do think as creatives that it has become increasingly challenging to mainly be able to sustain yourself while generating creative output, you know? And we all experienced that in different ways, it's a spectrum.

JVS: It does feel like a little bit of a love letter, the film is a love letter to an era that seems like is maybe past. You know, I'm really grateful that we can make a movie and stuff, but it was really born out of this renegade art scene that we all got to be a part of that seems like it really is only around in very small pockets. You know, like maybe Museum of Human Achievement has kind of helped sustain that DIY, weirdo, queer punk thing, but all the other places that we use to kind of collide with other creatives that allowed us to do this thing have either just really become commercialized or turned into condos. So, it is heartbreaking. I mean, the anxieties that Erica’s character expressed is like what a lot of artists who have been an in Austin for 10, 15, 20 years have been going through which isn't fun to say aloud, but it is kind of how I feel.

SS: Optimistically, conceptually, abstractly, I feel like queer art will continue to thrive one way or another. Whether or not it's like centralized in a place like Austin, I kind of like decentralized in a way like move it to a digital realm or otherwise, like you know, TBD. But there's no way people are going to just like cease creating or cease existing.

EN: No, but it's less accessible too. Before I feel like you could live like a slacker lifestyle or have a job and still be creating. You weren’t having to work so much to sustain a place to live in Austin.  So, I think it's a game for the young basically. It's still a bunch of young artists that are going to work for free and hustle hard, but there's an age limit and ceiling to that, that doesn't feel like it exists for me as a 40 year old artist in Austin. And then all the grants and stuff, we did that as we had to get help for the first round and the second round, we're like - I think it's just not there anymore because of COVID. You know, if four brains who obviously all prefer the creative part aren't able to easily access that kind of help then think about how many people aren't able to access that. So, it's all for people that have already been through academia and understand how to get that kind of money and support so it's just like…yeah. I mean, I obviously feel very worried for myself still, and maybe more! [Laughs]

JG: Yeah, I mean,  I recently moved to a little town south of Austin. And you know, I fell in love with Austin when I was 12 and got there as fast as I could and you know, it's just a wholly different city than the one that I felt so in love with, you know? I mean, I say that, but it's like, I'm still driving into Austin to do Austin things multiple times a week. So, I obviously still love the town and I don't really have another place that feels - I mean, I feel more connected to Austin as a place than anywhere, you know. But it's sad, I do see more and more people finding an escape route from Austin right now. And I see all the time, friends being like, “Oh, my apartment complexes are purposely forcing me out. My rental I've been in for 10 years is being sold and now I don't know if I can afford to live in this town anymore,” you know? And I mean, it's just pretty constant, you know, and yeah, places that felt like institutions shutting down and being replaced by money, like big money, you know? Oh, man, it's like, I don't know…it's incredibly depressing! [Laughs]

HFC: Thank you all for those truthful answers because yeah, it's like y'all mentioned, it’s a very unique town to be in that is going through some major changes, but, and this may be super romanticism of me, but I think art in the right time, the right place with the right people can make an effect and I think with this film at least, it's a good, if not stepping stone, just another stone to keep the that spirit alive. To this film's credit, I think it ends on a pretty positive note. Like, Erica runs and it's happy! And in a way, I guess that makes it even more tragic if you want to look at it that way. But the best art kind of, you know, juggles those kinds of different sides of the spectrum.

SS: Yeah, it's kind of sweet to give into the suspension of disbelief.

HFC: If someone interprets it as a great feel-good story maybe that will inspire and keep the good fight going. So you all put it out there! That's half the battle!

EN: And I might run again. I mean, I honestly have been watching a lot of the Veep lately…

JVS: I love that path for you!

EN: I know. I just feel like I need to take a high school government class [laughs] because Texas education was taught from my football coach at school, so I don't really know much about it, but I do feel that, yeah, I don't know. Might be the only path I have left!  I feel like it's the only thing that old women are allowed to do!

HFC: I'm already over the hour here with you guys and I don't want to hold you up too much, but I do want to end this on a little bit of a more cheerful note, I guess rather than the final state of Austin. So, I'm going to get a couple few quick questions off for all of yall. One question I had in regard to the Gwyneth Paltrow appearance, in a hypothetical situation, would you have loved to actually bring Gwyneth Paltrow on and play herself and say those lines in this film?

EN: NO!

JG: It would be really sad to not use Lynn, who played Gwyneth Paltrow, but it’d be hard to say no too.

SS: One of my biggest obsessions was that there was this kind of like Wizard of Oz throughline where a real person in Erica’s life represented this kind of deranged version of these characters. So in my interpretation of the film, which might not be everybody's interpretation of the film, like, no, it had to be Lynn!

JG: So, if Gwen called, we would probably make money or something. [Laughs] So that would be cool.

EN: I wish she would have just answered my Twitter.

SS: That needs explanation, like that Instagram DM that happened…

EN: An Instagram DM, yeah. I mean, I wrote her that message that's in the movie, and she really never wrote back, which I don't understand! Why?! Like, doesn't she have someone working for her that does that!

HFC: Did she at least look? Did you see the “read” notification? Or it was just on “sent”?

EN: I think it's hidden.

SS: Yeah, Jeremy and I are going to have to look at the screenshots that circulated from the group.

JVS: We were having a dispute where Erica was like, “I never did that!” and I'm like, “No, you told me this story,” and she's like, “No, you wrote that into the movie because you warped something I said once two years ago and that's so irresponsible of you but I just let you do it because you loved it,” and I'm like, “Give me your phone,” and then I go to Instagram and I hit the message on Gwyneth Paltrow’s thing and it was such a long essay that she wrote! I was screaming, I was howling!

EN: And it really was like word for word, right? And I was like, “No way!”

SS: You legitimately mentioned the crystal mining affecting the Lemur population! [Laughs]

HFC: On that note, if there was one celebrity you can bring on for a project who would it be?

JVS: We should bring Richard Simmons out of retirement.

SS: That's obviously the ultimate!

EN: That’s the ultimate person for me. I just have so many fantasies about making the world all do an aerobics dance like Richard Simmons at the same time and like Power Ranger’ing power together. You know like all the hands like [makes explosion noise] and [Richard Simmons] would like, come out!

HFC: Like Hands Across America.

EN: Yes! That's what I want! But did Hands Across America, did that really happen? It did, right?

SS: I mean in theory yeah!

EN: What about the ocean? How's does that work…it's just America?

SS: The contiguous United States! [Laughs]

JG: What about the Mighty Mississippi? [Laughs]

HFC: So…Fuck, Marry, Kill…the Erica’s First Holy Shit versions of God, Satan, or Mother Nature.

SS: Ohhhhh!

EN: God!

SS: Well, everyone's going to fuck Mother Nature because it's going to be the wildest fuck of your life, right?

EN: Yeahhh.

SS: So it was God, Mother Nature, and Satan?

EN: That’s so hard! Nikki!

SS: Honestly, marry Satan.

EN: I’d marry Nikki!

SS: Yeah, marry Nikki…

JG: I think I’d do God…

JVS: Yeah, I think the only proper answer is a Zoom orgy with all of them.

SS: Zoom orgy, that's the correct answer.

HFC: Final question for y'all looking towards the future…what are each of you excited about coming into this new year 2023? What's on the horizon for y'all that you are looking forward to. It can be anything: projects, life stuff, whatever you want to share.

JVS: We're bringing the film with a new live component to San Francisco which is in like three weeks. And yeah, it's really exciting, because we're kind of incorporating an element of what was supposed to be there when we started the film. And you know, Erica just has some really wild stuff that she's going to do to get the audience involved. So, I'm really stoked and it’s at a beautiful theater, that's mainly like drag shows, called Oasis. So very much looking forward to that!

EN: Yeah, I think we're just trying to ride this. Try to get it out to as many people as possible. Without a manager, it's been like, more difficult than I would think even knowing people in LA and stuff. I don't know, a lot of people but I know enough people to get a hold of enough people. And it's just been a lot more difficult to get it out there.

SS: Yeah. So much like the film, we've tried to explore some traditional paths and realized, you know, that that might not be the best fit for what we're trying to do. So, it's kind of us putting our heads together and seeing what kind of inventive ways we can achieve our goals.

EN: I mean obviously, yes, like, we want to work together more! More people give us moneyyy!

JG: Yeah, because in a way, it's hard to say what's the next thing because we're still so in the thick of what do we do with this thing that we made, you know? I knew it was meant to be kind of a softball question, but it doesn't feel that way.

SS: Yeah.

HFC: It's a hard question! I would hate if someone asked me that, because I couldn't give you an answer, so you're already doing better than me.

SS: You know, I think biggest goal is some kind of like widespread distribution plan, whatever form that comes in, you know? If it's going to be on OnlyFans if it's going to be, you know, uploaded direct directly to your conscious…

EN: I’d like this to somehow, like, you know, funnel a lot of attention to my workout classes and hire like two choreographers to help me be more prolific and get my Patreon really goosed up. Yeah, kind of still doing the same stuff or I have to run for mayor!

HFC: It was a lovely time talking to you guys. Again, I've already held you over so apologies for that! But thank you all for taking the time out of your day. Jeremy, Jessica, Sawyer, Erica, thank you all for creating a unique, to say the very least, film!